Challenges
Datasets
Workspaces
Papers
Discussions
Leaderboard
Log inSign up
Challenges
Datasets
Workspaces
Papers
Discussions
Leaderboard
Blog
Job Board
Q3AS

© 2026 Aqora Quantum S.A.S.

TermsPrivacyLegal Notice

arXiv:2207.11791

Reply to "Comment on 'Why interference phenomena do not capture the essence of quantum theory' "

Lorenzo Catani, Matthew Leifer, David Schmid, Robert W. Spekkens

Published Jul 24, 2022• 1 citation
arXivHTMLPDF

Abstract

Our article [arXiv:2111.13727(2021)] argues that the phenomenology of interference that is traditionally regarded as problematic does not, in fact, capture the essence of quantum theory -- contrary to the claims of Feynman and many others. It does so by demonstrating the existence of a physical theory, which we term the "toy field theory", that reproduces this phenomenology but which does not sacrifice the classical worldview. In their Comment [arXiv:2204.01768(2022)], Hance and Hossenfelder dispute our claim. Correcting mistaken claims found therein and responding to their criticisms provides us with an opportunity to further clarify some of the ideas in our article.

DOI
10.48550/arxiv.2207.11791

Related papers

Comment on "Why interference phenomena do not capture the essence of quantum theory"

Jonte R. Hance, Sabine Hossenfelder

It was recently argued by Catani et al that it is possible to reproduce the phenomenology of quantum interference classically, by the double-slit experiment with a deterministic, local, and classical model (Quantum 7, 1119 (2023)). The stated aim of their argument is to falsify the claim made by Feynman (in his third book of Lectures on Physics) that quantum interference is ``impossible, absolutely impossible, to explain in any classical way'' and that it ``contains the only mystery'' of quantum mechanics. We here want to point out some problems with their argument.

arXiv:2204.01768•Apr 4, 2022•1 citation

Why interference phenomena do not capture the essence of quantum theory

Lorenzo Catani, Matthew Leifer, David Schmid +1 more

Quantum interference phenomena are widely viewed as posing a challenge to the classical worldview. Feynman even went so far as to proclaim that they are the only mystery and the basic peculiarity of quantum mechanics. Many have also argued that basic interference phenomena force us to accept a number of radical interpretational conclusions, including: that a photon is neither a particle nor a wave but rather a Jekyll-and-Hyde sort of entity that toggles between the two possibilities, that reality is observer-dependent, and that systems either do not have properties prior to measurements or else have properties that are subject to nonlocal or backwards-in-time causal influences. In this work, we show that such conclusions are not, in fact, forced on us by basic interference phenomena. We do so by describing an alternative to quantum theory, a statistical theory of a classical discrete field (the `toy field theory') that reproduces the relevant phenomenology of quantum interference while rejecting these radical interpretational claims. It also reproduces a number of related interference experiments that are thought to support these interpretational claims, such as the Elitzur-Vaidman bomb tester, Wheeler's delayed-choice experiment, and the quantum eraser experiment. The systems in the toy field theory are field modes, each of which possesses, at all times, both a particle-like property (a discrete occupation number) and a wave-like property (a discrete phase). Although these two properties are jointly possessed, the theory stipulates that they cannot be jointly known . The phenomenology that is generally cited in favour of nonlocal or backwards-in-time causal influences ends up being explained in terms of inferences about distant or past systems, and all that is observer-dependent is the observer's knowledge of reality, not reality itself.

arXiv:2111.13727•Quantum•Sep 25, 2023•58 citations

Reply to "Comment on 'Experimentally adjudicating between different causal accounts of Bell-inequality violations via statistical model selection'"

Daley, Patrick, Kevin J. Resch, Robert W. Spekkens

Our article described an experiment that adjudicates between different causal accounts of Bell inequality violations by a comparison of their predictive power, finding that certain types of models that are structurally radical but parametrically conservative, of which a class of superdeterministic models are an example, overfit the data relative to models that are structurally conservative but parametrically radical in the sense of endorsing an intrinsically quantum generalization of the framework of causal modelling. In their comment (arXiv:2206.10619), Hance and Hossenfelder argue that we have misrepresented the purpose of superdeterministic models. We here dispute this claim by recalling the different classes of superdeterministic models we defined in our article and our conclusions regarding which of these are disfavoured by our experimental results. Their confusion on this point seems to have arisen in part from the fact that we characterized superdeterministic models within a causal modelling framework and from the fact that we referred to this framework as "classical" in order to contrast it with an intrinsically quantum alternative. In this reply, therefore, we take the opportunity to clarify these points. They also claim that if one is adjudicating between a pair of models, where one model can account for strictly more operational statistics than the other, the first model will tend to overfit the data relative to the second. Because this model inclusion relation can arise for pairs of models in a reductionist heirarchy, they conclude that overfitting should not be taken as evidence against the first model. We point out here that, contrary to this claim, one does not expect overfitting to arise generically in cases of model inclusion, so that it is indeed sometimes appropriate to consider overfitting as a criterion for adjudicating between such models.

arXiv:2412.02829•Dec 3, 2024•0 citations

Reply to the comment on ‘Two-state vector formalism and quantum interference’

F. A. Hashmi, Fu Li, Shi-Yao Zhu +1 more

Abstract In the preceding comment it is claimed that we are mistaken in the analysis of the theory of the ‘past of a quantum particle’ proposed by the author of the comment. We show that the claim is unfounded. Moreover we show that the arguments presented in the comment are not consistent with the already proposed theory.

Journal of Physics A Mathematical and Theoretical•Sep 19, 2017•13 citations

Reply to “Comment on ‘Experimentally adjudicating between different causal accounts of Bell-inequality violations via statistical model selection' ”

Patrick J. Daley, Kevin J. Resch, Robert W. Spekkens

Our article described an experiment that adjudicates between different causal accounts of Bell inequality violations by a comparison of their predictive power, finding that certain types of models that are structurally radical but parametrically conservative---of which a class of superdeterministic models are an example---overfit the data relative to models that are structurally conservative but parametrically radical in the sense of endorsing an intrinsically quantum generalization of the framework of causal modeling. In their comment [Phys. Rev. A 109, 026201 (2024)], Hance and Hossenfelder argue that we have misrepresented the purpose of superdeterministic models. We here dispute this claim by recalling the different classes of superdeterministic models we defined in our article and our conclusions regarding which of these are disfavored by our experimental results. Their confusion on this point seems to have arisen in part from the fact that we characterized superdeterministic models within a causal modeling framework and from the fact that we referred to this framework as ``classical'' in order to contrast it with an intrinsically quantum alternative. In this Reply, therefore, we take the opportunity to clarify these points. They also claim that if one is adjudicating between a pair of models, where one model can account for strictly more operational statistics than the other, the first model will tend to overfit the data relative to the second. Because this model inclusion relation can arise for pairs of models in a reductionist hierarchy, they conclude that overfitting should not be taken as evidence against the first model. We point out here that, contrary to this claim, one does not expect overfitting to arise generically in cases of model inclusion, so that it is indeed sometimes appropriate to consider overfitting as a criterion for adjudicating between such models.

Physical Review A•Jan 16, 2025•0 citations

Reply to “Comment on ‘Nonlocality claims are inconsistent with Hilbert-space quantum mechanics’ ”

Robert B. Griffiths

In Phys. Rev. A 101, 022117 (2020), it was argued that Bell inequalities are based on classical not quantum physics, and, hence, their violation in experiments provides no support for the claimed existence of peculiar nonlocal and superluminal influences in the real (quantum) world. This Reply to Lambare's Comment, Phys. Rev. A 104, 066201 (2021), on that paper seeks to clarify some issues related to the correct use of Hilbert space quantum mechanics for identifying the microscopic causes of later macroscopic measurement outcomes, a matter not properly addressed by Bell, who used classical hidden variables in place of the Hilbert subspaces (equivalently, their projectors) employed by von Neumann in Mathematical Foundations of Quantum Mechanics.

arXiv:2106.09824•Physical Review A•Dec 20, 2021•11 citations
Our article [arXiv:2111.13727(2021)] argues that the phenomenology of interference that is traditionally regarded as problematic does not, in fact, capture the essence of quantum theory -- contrary to the claims of Feynman and many others. It does so by demonstrating the existence of a physical theory, which we term the "toy field theory", that reproduces this phenomenology but which does not sacrifice the classical worldview. In their Comment [arXiv:2204.01768(2022)], Hance and Hossenfelder dispute our claim. Correcting mistaken claims found therein and responding to their criticisms provides us with an opportunity to further clarify some of the ideas in our article.
It was recently argued by Catani et al that it is possible to reproduce the phenomenology of quantum interference classically, by the double-slit experiment with a deterministic, local, and classical model (Quantum 7, 1119 (2023)). The stated aim of their argument is to falsify the claim made by Feynman (in his third book of Lectures on Physics) that quantum interference is ``impossible, absolutely impossible, to explain in any classical way'' and that it ``contains the only mystery'' of quantum mechanics. We here want to point out some problems with their argument.
Quantum interference phenomena are widely viewed as posing a challenge to the classical worldview. Feynman even went so far as to proclaim that they are the only mystery and the basic peculiarity of quantum mechanics. Many have also argued that basic interference phenomena force us to accept a number of radical interpretational conclusions, including: that a photon is neither a particle nor a wave but rather a Jekyll-and-Hyde sort of entity that toggles between the two possibilities, that reality is observer-dependent, and that systems either do not have properties prior to measurements or else have properties that are subject to nonlocal or backwards-in-time causal influences. In this work, we show that such conclusions are not, in fact, forced on us by basic interference phenomena. We do so by describing an alternative to quantum theory, a statistical theory of a classical discrete field (the `toy field theory') that reproduces the relevant phenomenology of quantum interference while rejecting these radical interpretational claims. It also reproduces a number of related interference experiments that are thought to support these interpretational claims, such as the Elitzur-Vaidman bomb tester, Wheeler's delayed-choice experiment, and the quantum eraser experiment. The systems in the toy field theory are field modes, each of which possesses, at all times, both a particle-like property (a discrete occupation number) and a wave-like property (a discrete phase). Although these two properties are jointly possessed, the theory stipulates that they cannot be jointly known . The phenomenology that is generally cited in favour of nonlocal or backwards-in-time causal influences ends up being explained in terms of inferences about distant or past systems, and all that is observer-dependent is the observer's knowledge of reality, not reality itself.
Our article described an experiment that adjudicates between different causal accounts of Bell inequality violations by a comparison of their predictive power, finding that certain types of models that are structurally radical but parametrically conservative, of which a class of superdeterministic models are an example, overfit the data relative to models that are structurally conservative but parametrically radical in the sense of endorsing an intrinsically quantum generalization of the framework of causal modelling. In their comment (arXiv:2206.10619), Hance and Hossenfelder argue that we have misrepresented the purpose of superdeterministic models. We here dispute this claim by recalling the different classes of superdeterministic models we defined in our article and our conclusions regarding which of these are disfavoured by our experimental results. Their confusion on this point seems to have arisen in part from the fact that we characterized superdeterministic models within a causal modelling framework and from the fact that we referred to this framework as "classical" in order to contrast it with an intrinsically quantum alternative. In this reply, therefore, we take the opportunity to clarify these points. They also claim that if one is adjudicating between a pair of models, where one model can account for strictly more operational statistics than the other, the first model will tend to overfit the data relative to the second. Because this model inclusion relation can arise for pairs of models in a reductionist heirarchy, they conclude that overfitting should not be taken as evidence against the first model. We point out here that, contrary to this claim, one does not expect overfitting to arise generically in cases of model inclusion, so that it is indeed sometimes appropriate to consider overfitting as a criterion for adjudicating between such models.
Our article described an experiment that adjudicates between different causal accounts of Bell inequality violations by a comparison of their predictive power, finding that certain types of models that are structurally radical but parametrically conservative---of which a class of superdeterministic models are an example---overfit the data relative to models that are structurally conservative but parametrically radical in the sense of endorsing an intrinsically quantum generalization of the framework of causal modeling. In their comment [Phys. Rev. A 109, 026201 (2024)], Hance and Hossenfelder argue that we have misrepresented the purpose of superdeterministic models. We here dispute this claim by recalling the different classes of superdeterministic models we defined in our article and our conclusions regarding which of these are disfavored by our experimental results. Their confusion on this point seems to have arisen in part from the fact that we characterized superdeterministic models within a causal modeling framework and from the fact that we referred to this framework as ``classical'' in order to contrast it with an intrinsically quantum alternative. In this Reply, therefore, we take the opportunity to clarify these points. They also claim that if one is adjudicating between a pair of models, where one model can account for strictly more operational statistics than the other, the first model will tend to overfit the data relative to the second. Because this model inclusion relation can arise for pairs of models in a reductionist hierarchy, they conclude that overfitting should not be taken as evidence against the first model. We point out here that, contrary to this claim, one does not expect overfitting to arise generically in cases of model inclusion, so that it is indeed sometimes appropriate to consider overfitting as a criterion for adjudicating between such models.
In Phys. Rev. A 101, 022117 (2020), it was argued that Bell inequalities are based on classical not quantum physics, and, hence, their violation in experiments provides no support for the claimed existence of peculiar nonlocal and superluminal influences in the real (quantum) world. This Reply to Lambare's Comment, Phys. Rev. A 104, 066201 (2021), on that paper seeks to clarify some issues related to the correct use of Hilbert space quantum mechanics for identifying the microscopic causes of later macroscopic measurement outcomes, a matter not properly addressed by Bell, who used classical hidden variables in place of the Hilbert subspaces (equivalently, their projectors) employed by von Neumann in Mathematical Foundations of Quantum Mechanics.